My thoughts,
I would go back to the original point, what is the objective of the Junior British Championship? By definition it should be looking for the best junior paddlers in the country. However, take into consideration:
o The holy grail for the top juniors is getting into the Junior GB team
o The top juniors are in the premier division or are trying to get promoted from division 1
o The priority outside of the GB junior selection races is the divisional ranking races, which means training, maximum water time at venues like HPP, Tryweryn and Grandtully etc
My personal view is in order to attract the top juniors you need to:
o Hold the race on a premier course, no disrespect to Llandysul, but the top juniors are not going to travel to a Div 2/3 venue
o Combine the event with a Premier race and/or British Open
However, more than likely, the J13s and below would be intimated (not all, but most) by racing on bigger water. Therefore, maybe there should be a split, and have two junior championships on separate courses, which reflect the ability/development of the paddlers at that age. For example, Llandysul for the J13 and below and HPP for J14 and above – that way I think you would increase the attendance and profile of the Junior British Championship.
British Champs - What is the objective of them?
My J13 son is at HPP all week paddling - and didn't want to travel to paddle on the 2/3 water so wasn't at Llandysul because he likes the harder water....!
so think also need to reflect the fact that there are now J12 and J13 paddlers in Division 1, paddling on Tully, Serpent's tail etc
Junior Div 2/3 championship vs Junior Div Prem/1 championship....?
so think also need to reflect the fact that there are now J12 and J13 paddlers in Division 1, paddling on Tully, Serpent's tail etc
Junior Div 2/3 championship vs Junior Div Prem/1 championship....?
The British Junior Champs used to include all age groups but it was recognised a few years ago that the top J18, J17 didn't attend so the Junior Champs was changed to J16,J14 Champs. The problem is that you want to attract the best paddlers but you also want to attract other juniors so that it is a good race. Whilst the best J16 and J15s could easily race on a Division 1 course, the majority of J14, J13,J12 could not. You could split the Junior Champs down further but that would be a shame as it is nice to see different aged juniors competing at the same race. What would be good, would be to have a venue that could have more challenging water for J16, J15 and easier water for J14 and under. Holme Pierrepont obviously managed this by running a Div 3/4 at the same time as the Div 1/2.
Also, clubs need to value these events and encourage their paddlers to attend.
It would also be good if the different age groups were shown as such in the results along with who won each age category along with some sort of promotional info after the event to highlight the winners. Other than on this chat, there has been nothing to promote the winners since the event - some photos and captions from the weekend would be good.
Also, clubs need to value these events and encourage their paddlers to attend.
It would also be good if the different age groups were shown as such in the results along with who won each age category along with some sort of promotional info after the event to highlight the winners. Other than on this chat, there has been nothing to promote the winners since the event - some photos and captions from the weekend would be good.
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John Sturgess
- Posts: 280
- Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 12:01 am
- Location: Gedling, Nottingham/Long Preston, North Yorkshire
I am not clear how CeeBee derives his conclusion that ‘most U14, U13 and U12 paddlers could not race on Div 1 water’.
While we should not aim to make the Junior Championships over-elitist, it seems sensible to target those Juniors who race regularly - which for the purposes of the Strategic Review is being taken as racing 9 or more Ranking races - 4.5 weekends - during a season.
Only 50 J16’s, 40 J14’s, and 48 J12’s and younger did that number of ranking races in kayak in 2010: so when we talk about how many compete in the Junior Championships, that is the field we are talking about.
Of those J16’s, 72% finished the season in Prem or Div 1, 92% in Div 2 or above.
Of those J14’s, 40% finished the season in Prem or Div 1, 75% in Div 2 or above.
Of those J12’s, only 8% finished the season in Prem or Div 1; but 65% in Div 2 or above.
So 107/138 regularly racing under-16 paddlers would expect to be racing on more-or-less challenging Div 1/2 courses: and that is clearly where the J14/J16 Championships should be raced.
While we should not aim to make the Junior Championships over-elitist, it seems sensible to target those Juniors who race regularly - which for the purposes of the Strategic Review is being taken as racing 9 or more Ranking races - 4.5 weekends - during a season.
Only 50 J16’s, 40 J14’s, and 48 J12’s and younger did that number of ranking races in kayak in 2010: so when we talk about how many compete in the Junior Championships, that is the field we are talking about.
Of those J16’s, 72% finished the season in Prem or Div 1, 92% in Div 2 or above.
Of those J14’s, 40% finished the season in Prem or Div 1, 75% in Div 2 or above.
Of those J12’s, only 8% finished the season in Prem or Div 1; but 65% in Div 2 or above.
So 107/138 regularly racing under-16 paddlers would expect to be racing on more-or-less challenging Div 1/2 courses: and that is clearly where the J14/J16 Championships should be raced.
The position at the end of the season is not applicable in this instance as this event was held in the first half of the season. Paddlers tend to improve significantly during the season i.e. from April onwards as they race and get more experience.
A Division 1/2 course may well be a good compromise but that depends on the course e.g. Grandtully is a Div 1/2 in August but some of the new promotees to Div 1 and certainly Division 2 will not be ready. Running it here could exclude the youngest age groups.
Part of it depends on the aim of the event. Obviously we want the best paddler in that age group to win but I would also argue that we want a decent field of competitors to make the event worthwhile and for it to feel like a real competition. Therefore, you need to try to accommodate both.
The junior Champs is a great event for paddlers to attend and race against their own age group. Clubs need to encourage their paddlers to attend.
A Division 1/2 course may well be a good compromise but that depends on the course e.g. Grandtully is a Div 1/2 in August but some of the new promotees to Div 1 and certainly Division 2 will not be ready. Running it here could exclude the youngest age groups.
Part of it depends on the aim of the event. Obviously we want the best paddler in that age group to win but I would also argue that we want a decent field of competitors to make the event worthwhile and for it to feel like a real competition. Therefore, you need to try to accommodate both.
The junior Champs is a great event for paddlers to attend and race against their own age group. Clubs need to encourage their paddlers to attend.